23+ Front Axle change too?

[VB!]

All of it is overblown.

Agreed. This is a lot of talk and consternation over a half inch difference.

 

[ramv]

Do we know the axle shaft size/spline count in the new axle?

 

[Apples]

Agreed. This is a lot of talk and consternation over a half inch difference.

That's what my wife said.

But, seriously... just had a short convo w/ Go0gle AI. Towards the end of it I had to go out and physically look at the engineering number on the longer axle tube label.

I had orginally asked it earlier about the M235 axle itself. That's another story, because Google AI was mistaken. We cannot expect it to be correct just yet, if ever.

That said, I had to reaffirm my count last year of 14 bolts on the diff cover.

Me:
"Hello again. Same topic: 2025 F350 XLT Tremor Package truck has a 14-bolt cover and the big white tag affixed to the longer axle housing tube reads D - 058 - B

AI:
"The 14-bolt cover and "D-058-B" white tag you found are the absolute proof that your 2025 F-350 XLT Tremor actually has the Dana AdvanTEK M235 front axle, rather than the M256.
This means Ford quietly changed the Tremor's front axle specification following the 2023 redesign.

Why Your 2025 Tremor Has the M235 Front Axle

• The 14-Bolt Cover is the Giveaway: The legacy Dana M256 (Dana 60 layout) strictly features a 10-bolt differential cover. Dana's newer AdvanTEK M235 series features a 14-bolt cover. Because your cover has 14 bolts, you have a physical M235 carrier housing. [1, 2, 3]
• The "D-058-B" Tag: The letter "D" stands for Dana, the manufacturer. The numeric sequence (058) corresponds directly to Ford's factory engineering part assembly variants mapping to the Dana AdvanTEK M235 architecture with the Trac-Lok limited-slip differential assigned to the Tremor line.
• The Running Production Shift: While early 2023 Tremor packaging retained the M256 legacy axles, Ford completely streamlined production for later model years. To simplify assembly lines, all single-rear-wheel (SRW) F-250 and F-350 configurations—including the Tremor package—now utilize the M235 front axle casing. [1]

What This Means for Your Tremor Package

Your truck still retains the specific clutch-type limited slip differential that separates the Tremor from standard open-differential models. The internal carrier utilizes the exact same clutch pack mechanics and requires the exact same Motorcraft XL-3 friction modifier fluid rules discussed previously. [1, 2]

Dana designed the AdvanTEK M235 ring-and-pinion gear geometry to handle the extreme torque of modern high-output powertrains, allowing Ford to confidently use this 14-bolt housing across the entire SRW Super Duty platform without sacrificing durability."

Do we know the axle shaft size/spline count in the new axle?

Lemme aks!

"Do we know the axle shaft size/spline count in this Dana AdvanTEK M235 axle?"

AI:
"Yes, the exact industry specifications for the Dana AdvanTEK M235 architecture have been well documented by Dana Spicer. The AdvanTEK M235 front axle utilizes 30-spline inner axle shafts paired with a shaft diameter of 1.50 inches. [1, 2]
The layout differs from the previous generation's components in a few key ways:

Axle Shaft & Spline Breakdown

• Inner Axle Shaft Splines: 30-spline. [1]
• Inner Axle Shaft Diameter: 1.50 inches. (While it dropped from the legacy 35-spline count, Dana kept the robust 1.50-inch shaft thickness but changed the pressure angles and width of the teeth). [1, 2]
• The Outer Stub Shafts: 35-spline. Dana retained the larger 35-spline outer stub shafts at the wheel ends. This design allows Ford to use the exact same heavy-duty knuckles, massive unit bearings, and standard locking hub assemblies across all F-250 and F-350 trucks. [1, 2, 3, 4]
• Pinion Gear Splines: 28-spline. The input pinion shaft features a 28-spline count mating to a smaller pinion nut and yoke assembly than the old M256 setup. [1, 2]

A Direct Heritage: The Modern Dana 50
To put these dimensions into perspective, the "235" in M235 stands for a 235mm ring gear (9.25 inches). In classic truck nomenclature, this makes the M235 the modernized, high-pinion AdvanTEK version of the legacy Dana 50 (which historically featured 30-spline inner shafts and a 9.25-inch ring gear). [1, 2]
By comparison, the massive M256/Super Dana 60 that your truck bypassed utilizes a 256mm ring gear (10.08 inches) and 35-spline inner axle shafts. [1, 2]
Even though the inner spline count is lower, the massive 1.50-inch main shaft thickness and high-grade steel alloys mean your Tremor front end is still fully equipped to handle severe off-road environments without breaking a shaft. [1]"

 

[majorbison]

first they take away the screen off button for the sync and then they downgrade my axle

thanks for nothin ford

 

[The Evil Twin]

first they take away the screen off button for the sync and then they downgrade my axle

thanks for nothin ford

I’ve done some reading about the 235 axle. It isn’t necessarily a downgrade. Yes, the ring is smaller, but there is more gear contact surface with the pinion. The GAWR is very close to the D60.

 

[ramv]

Yeah, the other thing is changing the contact angle to run 30 splines instead of 35. Really doesn't matter, the 1.5" staying the same is the key. More ground clearance too. The only major downside I see is no aftermarket (yet) so no lockers, gears, etc.

 

[majorbison]

Just being sassy. I got a lot out of my supposedly weak Dana 44’s. Dudes swore 37’s were too big for them. An old timer on ih8mud said people were saying the same things about 33’s and then 35’s on earlier Jeeps. Seems like if you know what you’re doing or at least don’t hammer down when in doubt your axles will do just fine.

I haven’t had a use for the front limited slip yet in the Tremor, I’ll try to test it out next time I’m in the desert. Wondering how it holds up next to an actual locker. I don’t think I’ve ever necessarily needed a front locker but the confidence that comes with it is nice to have.


Also I love this dudes truck. Part of me wants to go find a high mile previous landscapers rig or something and push it like this. The smarter, more reasonable side is telling me to just buy another JLUR for a toy lol

 

[Blade420Play🔪🏆]

Just being sassy. I got a lot out of my supposedly weak Dana 44’s. Dudes swore 37’s were too big for them. An old timer on ih8mud said people were saying the same things about 33’s and then 35’s on earlier Jeeps. Seems like if you know what you’re doing or at least don’t hammer down when in doubt your axles will do just fine.

I haven’t had a use for the front limited slip yet in the Tremor, I’ll try to test it out next time I’m in the desert. Wondering how it holds up next to an actual locker. I don’t think I’ve ever necessarily needed a front locker but the confidence that comes with it is nice to have.


Also I love this dudes truck. Part of me wants to go find a high mile previous landscapers rig or something and push it like this. The smarter, more reasonable side is telling me to just buy another JLUR for a toy lol

View attachment 262370

 

[MVI]

Just being sassy. I got a lot out of my supposedly weak Dana 44’s. Dudes swore 37’s were too big for them. An old timer on ih8mud said people were saying the same things about 33’s and then 35’s on earlier Jeeps. Seems like if you know what you’re doing or at least don’t hammer down when in doubt your axles will do just fine.

I haven’t had a use for the front limited slip yet in the Tremor, I’ll try to test it out next time I’m in the desert. Wondering how it holds up next to an actual locker. I don’t think I’ve ever necessarily needed a front locker but the confidence that comes with it is nice to have.


Also I love this dudes truck. Part of me wants to go find a high mile previous landscapers rig or something and push it like this. The smarter, more reasonable side is telling me to just buy another JLUR for a toy lol

View attachment 262370

obviously a LONGBED Tremor.

 

[5150]

Smaller ring, pinion, yoke. It isn't as strong as the 60. It is cheaper. Bottom line.

 

[MVI]

Smaller ring, pinion, yoke. It isn't as strong as the 60. It is cheaper. Bottom line.

@ramv

it's the 30 spline vs 35 spline that gets in the way.

Same 1.5" shaft, the 30 spline will fail sooner in a loaded situation, the involute tooth profile cant change that much with whatever they did. I do realize that these are static shafts at the 30 or 35 ends, but the std is involute for the profile

end of the day, it's all about the root of the tooth's bending stress.

 

[5150]

Well at least now the smaller pinion shaft or smaller yoke or smaller u-joint might break first.

 

[The Evil Twin]

Don’t hear about a lot of failures though.

 

[Toxophilite]

Don’t hear about a lot of failures though.

Agreed - When these first came out on the 23’s everyone was pissed (including me), but I honestly haven’t heard of any problems with them. However, they are only in 3 year and newer trucks, so not many of them have been really tested yet and aren’t being wheeled real hard. In a few years, these will start hitting junk yards and the Jeep and Toyota guys will start upgrading with them, we will see if they hold up.

What we really need is a locker for them. I talked to ARB at the overland expo in April and they said this axle/differential is on their list for new development. Hopefully we see one by the end of the year.

 

[ramv]

@ramv

it's the 30 spline vs 35 spline that gets in the way.

Same 1.5" shaft, the 30 spline will fail sooner in a loaded situation, the involute tooth profile cant change that much with whatever they did. I do realize that these are static shafts at the 30 or 35 ends, but the std is involute for the profile

end of the day, it's all about the root of the tooth's bending stress.

View attachment 262403

If you have wheeled with 14 bolt (AAM guys) which are 30 spline 1.5” axle shaft shafts they don’t break. Even my 32 spline Dana 60/70 in my Ram for the most part broke mid axle shaft or at the U-joints to the unjoints. The rears mainly broke at the neck down but I did explode one which broke clean of the flange (1.5”+) and explode everything on the splined end. Never saw that before or again, an axle shaft break both ends.

I never broke a ring and pinion or locker despite scattering dozens of Dana 44,60 and 70 axle shafts and a few Ram 9.25”s. Ultimately the weak spot is ujoints or the shafts themselves which if the have upgraded the alloy from the old 10/15 series than they could likely be quite strong. For the record, I’m not saying bigger isn’t bigger, But I am saying the weak spot isn’t the splines.

 

[dzrtdzl]

Lol, I broke my front AAM 9.25 ring and pinion climbing Baldwins hill in JV. Oops!!