Godzilla Down...And Now Back Up - Update on Page 2

Avslash said:
You understand those plans exist to make a profit for the issuer, correct?
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You understand humor is to make people laugh, correct?
 
Optimus said:
"Nice Jeep, Peasant". This is what @TRAMPER needs.
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My friend has this on his Porsche. He absolutely wheels the shit out of this thing.
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Thanks for posting that. First time I have come across those guys.

If I wasn't 12 years down the Land Rover rabbit hole I would be browsing for a Cayenne donor vehicle.
 
Most auto mfg has warts- my cousin is on second engine and third transmission for 2021 Tahoe. His son is on second engine and second transmission on 2022 Yukon. Both less than 20k mi. 55k on my 7.3 tremor with minor inconvenience thus far. I hope it stays minor. I hope repairs are reasonable for your situation.
 
Avslash said:
I might run the math on the ESP. I have never purchased an extended warranty on any vehicle. I have have had . I have purchased 13 new vehicles for my wife, children or myself since married and at least 20 business vehicles in that time. If I have to lay out $15-$17k out of pocket to get this one back up and running, I bet after running time value of money calculation I am still ahead. And I bet it’s not even close.
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I always do the ESP with all computer crap on vechiles these days...One more 8 hr trip to the dealer to chase down issues with APIM module and ESP on my Tremor will have paid for itself. Hell loose a couple keys and the ESP pays for itself.

Buddy had the bad lifers in his motor, they didn't even tear it down at the dealership, pulled the motor sent it to engineering and shipped him a new one...his truck was down about 2 weeks...runs fine now, he had 9k on his when it shit the bed.
 
Avslash said:
I might run the math on the ESP. I have never purchased an extended warranty on any vehicle. I have have had . I have purchased 13 new vehicles for my wife, children or myself since married and at least 20 business vehicles in that time. If I have to lay out $15-$17k out of pocket to get this one back up and running, I bet after running time value of money calculation I am still ahead. And I bet it’s not even close.
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No way know how you run without extended warranty on these rigs unless u flip yearly. Too many high priced things that can go wrong! Once one happens you will be kicking yourself without the ext. warranty!
 
So I've NEVER gotten an ESP before, but I panicked when I had 34K miles on my 14 month old tremor and got a 7yr/150K extension for like $4000, from some Ford Dealer. Like SccritterKiller said above, with all the electronic crap, anything that happens is $1000+ per occurrence
 
DwnSth said:
No way know how you run without extended warranty on these rigs unless u flip yearly. Too many high priced things that can go wrong! Once one happens you will be kicking yourself without the ext. warranty!
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You realize it is a gamble tilted in favor of the house, just like craps or blackjack in a casino? Ford is the house in this case, and if it was not profitable for Ford to offer them, they would either not be offered or offered at a higher price. I would wager they have a VERY detailed pricing model that provides them a 10% or higher rate of return on each policy sold after projected payouts on each policy. They do have the failure data for each assembly after all, which we consumers do not.

Maybe you can make a case that an individual that is so non-liquid that they could not fund an out of warranty repair should own one so they can sleep at night, but even in that case, you are still playing the house's game.
 
Avslash said:
You realize it is a gamble tilted in favor of the house, just like craps or blackjack in a casino? Ford is the house in this case, and if it was not profitable for Ford to offer them, they would either not be offered or offered at a higher price. I would wager they have a VERY detailed pricing model that provides them a 10% or higher rate of return on each policy sold after projected payouts on each policy. They do have the failure data for each assembly after all, which we consumers do not.

Maybe you can make a case that an individual that is so non-liquid that they could not fund an out of warranty repair should own one so they can sleep at night, but even in that case, you are still playing the house's game.
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You must hate insurance too. You may never need to use it, but damn is it worth it when you do need it.

For me the ESP was peace of mind when getting my 2021. Had a bad tank of diesel wipe out a hpfp in my 2010 and that truck had no ESP. But thankfully my insurance picked up most of that bill under a comprehensive claim.

Btw im sorry to hear the troubles your truck is giving you. Hope everything works out in the end.
 
TremorKR said:
You must hate insurance too. You may never need to use it, but damn is it worth it when you do need it.

For me the ESP was peace of mind when getting my 2021. Had a bad tank of diesel wipe out a hpfp in my 2010 and that truck had no ESP. But thankfully my insurance picked up most of that bill under a comprehensive claim.

Btw im sorry to hear the troubles your truck is giving you. Hope everything works out in the end.
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Thanks.

Insurance is a pretty good comparison, as those guys are in it to make money as well, but it's often a requirement under state law, terms of a mortgage, etc.

I guess it really depends on what risk tolerance an individual has, and what they would consider a "catastrophic" loss. You bring up a very valid point in whether some people might be paying twice for the same protection if they maintain comprehensive coverage under their auto policy and also purchase an ESP.
 
Insurance, as with ESP, is nothing but a game of statistics and risk tolerance.

Underwriters will not sell you a policy for less than their actuarial and statistical expectation of payout. The ESP, much like insurance policies, is out to make money (on the net, of course you can find the hand-selected example of when it saved someone's ass).

Where they do well is with people who are risk averse, and would rather diversify their risk into payments of $100/mo, rather than have the potential for an unexpected $5k - $10k expense, no matter how unlikely.

I fall more into the other camp, which is to have cash on hand in case of BS. Over the course of a lifetime, this strategy will cost less, even if stroking the occasional $5k - $10k check really sucks.

The difference between ESP and insurance is one is required by law, because it turns out, people are not as prepared as they think they are to insure themselves in the event of a $100k bang-up.
 
rbimd said:
So I've NEVER gotten an ESP before, but I panicked when I had 34K miles on my 14 month old tremor and got a 7yr/150K extension for like $4000, from some Ford Dealer. Like SccritterKiller said above, with all the electronic crap, anything that happens is $1000+ per occurrence
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I did the same exact thing I was at 33k and panicked and went and bought one ASAP mine was 8yr/125k for just under 4k as well.
 
Avslash said:
You realize it is a gamble tilted in favor of the house, just like craps or blackjack in a casino? Ford is the house in this case, and if it was not profitable for Ford to offer them, they would either not be offered or offered at a higher price. I would wager they have a VERY detailed pricing model that provides them a 10% or higher rate of return on each policy sold after projected payouts on each policy. They do have the failure data for each assembly after all, which we consumers do not.

Maybe you can make a case that an individual that is so non-liquid that they could not fund an out of warranty repair should own one so they can sleep at night, but even in that case, you are still playing the house's game.
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Plus side is If you decide to flip early, you get a prorated refund back depending on how many miles you’ve driven it. So at least you don’t lose everything if you sell.
 
Well, here is the update, and I'm going to have to eat a little crow on this one. Maybe...

Turns out I MOSTLY fixed it....

Dealer called yesterday and said truck was ready to go. I was a little surprised as last I had heard from them was a bank 1 valvetrain issue, which would fall right in with the reports of lifter/cam issues on the 7.3. Dealer dismissed that and basically said "nope, that guy was wrong after I had my heavy line tech look at it". He went on to say that I had caused the issue when I changed the plugs and swapped the coils from one bank to the other by mounting one of the ignition coils with the wrong side facing the valve cover.

I had to back him up a bit by reminding him that the only reason I swapped the coils position was I was attempting to isolate a bank 1 misfire. I basically told him I didn't just wander into the driveway one night and decide to start moving things around under the hood for the hell of it. I also reminded him that I specified the issue was occurring only at 75% or more throttle and above 4,000 rpm and asked if his tech had replicated those conditions on a test drive. He was unsure of that, so agreed to have the tech drive it again before I picked it up but opined that it must have been a bad plug or plug wire that caused the initial misfire issue and that I had solved that, but created a another misfire by mounting the coil upside down, as all his techs had done was pull the codes, flipped one coil over and test drove to confirm no misfire. That is very possible, given the plug wire issues that are known on the 7.3 and I hope he is correct. I picked up the truck and hammered the throttle a few times on the way home, and so far so good.

Only thing I can imagine is that the coils only have shielding on the bottom and by mounting it upside down it was arcing to the block or some other ground source and the plug was not firing. I also can't deny I might have mounted a coil upside down, as I was doing that work in torrential downpour and cussing life in general at the time. So, 8 plug wires, 8 spark plugs and $240ish to the dealer to flip over a coil and we are good for the moment. I'm about to put 600ish miles on it this weekend, so time and distance will tell.

Still glad I didn't buy an ESP...:)
 
Longrangehunter said:
Insurance, as with ESP, is nothing but a game of statistics and risk tolerance.

Underwriters will not sell you a policy for less than their actuarial and statistical expectation of payout. The ESP, much like insurance policies, is out to make money (on the net, of course you can find the hand-selected example of when it saved someone's ass).

Where they do well is with people who are risk averse, and would rather diversify their risk into payments of $100/mo, rather than have the potential for an unexpected $5k - $10k expense, no matter how unlikely.

I fall more into the other camp, which is to have cash on hand in case of BS. Over the course of a lifetime, this strategy will cost less, even if stroking the occasional $5k - $10k check really sucks.

The difference between ESP and insurance is one is required by law, because it turns out, people are not as prepared as they think they are to insure themselves in the event of a $100k bang-up.
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New Hampshire does not "require" car insurance. Sure most states may require car insurance, but then theres a large variable with the extent of the coverage you buy. Is there differences between ESP and insurance, yeh its not an exact apples to apples. However, basic principals are the same. You pay a fee, they cover the cost on unexpected events per your plan or agreement.

If youre so concerned about bottom dollar and beating ford or whatever company out of 1k, why even buy a new truck? You know they profit off you, right?

Listen im not hear to sell you an ESP or say your an idiot for not getting one as some may have slighted. We are aware big manufacturers and insurance companies make money on these, otherwise why would they do them? We buy them for peace of mind, time and to protect ourselves from the unexpected. Personally I also didnt want to have to work on my daily rig for the next 6 years. Pay $100, drop it off at the dealer and its done. Not wasting my time diagnosing, asking forums whats wrong, going to this guy that guy, trying this to then not work etc. It works for me. Im happy for those that can run without an ESP and not worry. Just dont bitch about repair costs then. You assumed that liability, to save money.
 
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