Not sure I want to mess with the factory tail lights, but if you can share the diagrams, I'll have them should I get frustrated. Thanks.
‘24 Owners Who Removed Tailgate
- OP 🔹 cs0430
- Start date
If you’re interested in buying a new harness to modify,
Hmmm, is that legit or knock-off? $19.99 seems suspect. Someone had previous mentioned it was $100 or $200 (don't recall exactly as it was so silly I didn't even consider it). But maybe I'm totally remembering wrong. I haven't looked it up on a trustworthy Ford OEM parts store. ebay is decidedly not that. Ha.
Someone said Fords price is 245.00??
I bought one. It has the same Ford part numbers and tags everywhere. Outer bag, individual parts.
If it’s a copy, it’s a good copy!
ebay knockoffs are hit or miss. Sometimes they are the exact same part as OEM because they are from the same assembly line and just sold through alternate channels than Ford and for closer to cost (shows how much Ford and all the OEMs marks these things up). If these are not imported to the US through typical channels, they are called "Gray Market" as they are original parts, but just not covered under warranty, avoid import terrifs, etc. Gray market is popular purchase path for high end camera equipment as the savings are significant...until you need warranty work and then you are on your own because gray market has no warranty. But we are talking a wire harness for next to nothing, so no big impact.
Other times, the knockoffs are made is different factorys of inferior parts and are simply counterfeit. And that is big business. They illegally print Brand logos and part numbers and claim to be OEM. Even Amazon is getting really bad with this stuff. No way to tell if something is really OEM from Amazon and especially ebay, anymore. Those online retailers could care less and don't even try to weed out counterfeits. Have experienced this with everything from the Ford "OEM" backup camera that was a knock off to Toyota oil filters and other such parts.
But with a harness such as this, it seems worth a try. And most will let you return it, on their dime, if it doesn't work, so not a lot of risk. And, I don't feel too bad about trying a $20 knock off if Ford is charging $250 for a harness that they pay $5 to have manufactures.
One off thing is they are calling this a Trailer Tow Kit. It has nothing to do with towing a trailer. It is a Tailgate Removal Kit.
I have a 2024 Lariat with 360 camera, etc.
I am picking up my new Hawk in February so trying to get my non-mechanical head around what I need to do to keep as much of the factory options working once tailgate removed. I ordered what they call the complex camera which is supposed to work with the factory 360 camera.
Besides just taking my truck in on install day what should I expect as far as what functions I will lose if any and anything I need to take action on.
@AdvTremor Whether you remove the tailgate in advance or they remove it during the install, you'll want to install the "tailgate removal kit" that came in your glove box. They call it some other confusing name on the package (something with trailering I think it is), but the kit is for when you remove the tailgate. The harness (wires with 2.5" wide connector at each end) runs between the gray and black connectors that are left vacant when you remove the tailgate. There are also several dummy plugs to cap the other connectors you unplug when removing the tailgate (camera, light, other features).
This is where the fun begins. With the '24, the harness is missing the needed grounds to trick the truck into thinking the right and left tailgate latches are fully closed. So even with the harness in place, you'll get the tailgate ajar pop-up message that you have to OK away and the red tailgate ajar light will stay on in the lower right hand corner of your gauge display. There are some side effects to the tailgate ajar message coming on. Things like some backup sensor functions not working, auto-fold in side mirrors not working, etc. Totally drivable, but the fix in this thread cures it. You add three pins/pigtails and connect them together to add ground from a grounded pin to the two other ungrounded pins.
Related to the camera, when the tailgate is removed and the backup camera unplugged on the '24, you'll just get a blue screen on both your backup view and the backup/rear part of your 360 screen. All the other 360 cameras work on the '24 when the tailgate camera is unplugged. Many '23 owners were not so lucky and all their other cameras bricked when the backup camera was removed.
Once FWC plugs in the aftermarket camera, if it is compatible, your back up camera and all other views will function as normal, even if the tailgate ajar issue is there. The tailgate ajar issue and camera view are separate and don't impact one another. Only thing to realize with the camera view is that, unless they place it the same height and centered location it is when tailgate is on, your camera view will be skewed. Many camper manufacturers place their camera solution above the door to avoid having the camera on a hinged surface (the door), but it will still give you a reasonably good view even though it's higher in the air. The view will simply be wider and so objects will be smaller on the screen.
Thank you. So it sounds like the three pins/pigtails and ground might be the only issue. I am wondering if this is a warranty issue and if I take to my local Ford dealer if they will take care of this. Kind of hate messing with a $80k or so truck on my own. What do you think will Ford take care of this at the dealer?
They should and will take care of this under warranty. They will just need some firm nudging as they likely don't know the solution unless that has made it back up to the mother ship and Ford is telling dealership tech the solution when they open a ticket with Ford. Some dealerships first try to say it's normal, but then can't explain why there is even a tailgate removal kit if it functions the same whether the kit is connected or not. Nor answer why all previous years, including '23, have wiring harnesses that eliminate the 'tailgate ajar' message, but the '24 does not.
Many of us have tickets open at our dealerships who then opened tickets with Ford. Once the issue and solution was found by a Ford tech that gave a damn and actually took the time to test the pins and sorted through it, there is now a fix documented by a Ford tech (copies of that work ticket are in this thread).
You'll likely need to bring in the specific details (and pictures) from this thread and spoon feed it to them so they can have pins and pigtails on hand and know exactly which three pin locations they are grounding together in which connector. Start the process now so you are ready to go by Feb when you remove your tailgate and pick up your camper as fixing this through your dealership will likely require a fair bit of runway and clock is ticking.
Before you even take it in, though, I recommend you test yours yourself to confirm if it is or is not working correctly.
First, to familiarize yourself with what you'll see, drop the tailgate and start the truck. You'll correctly see a Tailgate ajar message and also the little red tailgate ajar light in the lower right of your display. That is functioning as designed because, well, your tailgate is down. Not to test with the 'Tailgate Removal Harness"...
You do not have to remove the tailgate for this test. It being open is all that is needed.
Crawl under your truck and unplug the larger gray and black connectors, then run the tailgate removal harness between those two. No need to mess with the camera or other tailgate connectors; only the large gray and large black connectors. They can be a bit finicky to remove, but be patient. Maybe tap them repeatedly with the handle of a screwdriver to knock loose some of the dust and grit that inevitably cake them and can make the two halves of a plug resist pulling apart. Otherwise, you just push in the clip and wiggle them apart (try not to pull directly on the wires).
With the two connectors unplugged from our tailgate harness and the tailgate removal harness run between them and our tailgate lowered (which technically doesn't matter at this point because the tailgate isn't plugged into your truck), start up our pickup and odds are, you'll receive a Tailgate Ajar message that you have to OK away and the little red tailgate ajar light in the lower right of your display. If you do, make an appointment. If not...that would be an interesting turn of events. Either way, please report back as you progress through this with your testing and your dealership. Many of us didn't want to wait for our dealerships to do the work so did the fix ourselves, but I would love to see more do it through their dealership and then post copies of the work order in this thread. Plus, then hopefully that will help out other owners at that dealership and maybe even the info will get back to Ford and they can start making correctly grounded harnesses for owners and correct the issue, rather than repeating it, for 2025 model year.
Of note, since you didn't unplug your camera, your backup camera should still function even with the tailgate ajar message. This will be how your FWC backup camera would function if you don't get the tailgate harness fixed by the time you pick it up. Camera works just fine.
Thank you for taking the time to reply in detail. I will see what happens.
Does this look like the kit you received? Looks like one piece stung together (the big piece) and four other separate small connectors.
Does it look like this kit contains the fix for the ground?
That is the kit in question. Hard to see in that picture, but the wires going into the back of the black plug looks like the version that has the issue. If it only has six wires going into it, and they are all in a row, that is the one that doesn't work. See the picture in the following post of mine before I did the fix.
https://www.fordtremor.com/threads/24-owners-who-removed-tailgate.18096/post-403303
...and in this post, it shows the fix; three slots to which pins and wires are added and wired together (three big green wires in this image). They kind of block the view to the six smaller wires in the other row with are in the stock harness.
https://www.fordtremor.com/threads/24-owners-who-removed-tailgate.18096/post-404316
https://www.fordtremor.com/threads/24-owners-who-removed-tailgate.18096/post-404316
I have a '23 350 KR DRW, Arctic Fox truck camper.
My tail gate has 2 camera - one below the handle and one on the top of the tail gate for rear view/sensors when gate is down.
I've been having similar issues as described throughout with the gate off (for camper) - mirrors not folding, no lights flash, but I do have the use of all connected cameras except rear view. I occasionally I get the ajar light on the dash and it is always reflected on the screen when I am in a camera view.
It seems there are specific differences in trim levels, these are called out on the up-fitter bed delete documents (Special Vehicle Engineering (SVE) Bulletin Q-356R8 Body Builders Advisory Service for MY '23 & '24). In this doc trim levels are referred to as Low series (STX, XLT and below), Mid series (Lariat & KR), and High series (plat & Limited).
On my truck Factory delete plugs look exactly like those I've seen posted on this thread for '24 models - pre and post modified pics attached - modified pic is the one with black plug (3 green leads soldered together).
To pull my gate my gate I remove the big black & white plug, small plug (lowest position), and camera, the 3 other plugs have dummy/caps on them. I don't know how the second camera (gate down) is connected or activated.
I added the 3 wires to the plug to see if I could get the mirror fold and light flash with the gate off - but it doesn't work.
I bought the camera source adjustable kit with camera - didn't see the small print in the drop downs that states it doesn't work with the dual tail gate cameras - it doesn't. Going to open my gate to see the actual camera part number and see how the second camera is connected... more to come.
NOTES:
1. With gate off but wired up, tripped the lock latches to simulate a locked gate (see note 2 about black plug). Will throw a multi meter on each pin to identify what changes when manipulating the latches.
2. When I unplugged all tailgate plugs, except large black - all lock and folding mirror function properly. Disconnected the black plug and reconnected all others no folding mirrors or light flashes. Seems the "locked/unlocked" condition happens on the black plug side. When i disconnected the black plug while locked, this set off the alarm (unexpected - but makes sense).
3. All gate plugs off except camera and camera works.
4. I noticed that the black plug has contacts in the large positions at the 4 corners of the plug, but the delete plug has nothing - would like to know the function/connectivity of all pins.
5. After Christmas will go to a couple of dealerships to see if I can get a wiring diagram of the tailgate - I was an aircraft electrician in the AF, I hope to be able interpret and figure this out.
Not sure if this is year, model, or trim, but figured out that the drivers side latch on that latch triggers the door locked/ajar and associated mirror fold/light flash. Traced the wires to the gate plug. Tested the passenger side latch- it does not trigger anything.
The gate latching provides a ground. Modified the black plug on the delete cable. Took one of the 3 green wires previously installed and moved it to complete the ground on the corner position on the delete plug. Pics of back and the two required positions on the front. I left the 3rd wire - seems like no function on my truck.
Next challenge getting the correct camera so I can mount to the rear of the camper.
Attachments
Not sure if I should start a new thread - feel free to comment.
I've solved the issues with my truck and removing the tailgate - pic is in my previous post.
Now I am trying to figure out the cameras in the tailgate, it appears that the '23 & '24 King Ranch up to Limited have the standard rear view + the "tail gate down" rear view (2 cameras).
I've removed the cameras and tried both connected directly under the truck.
When I do this, it kills all cameras - I suspect that there is a controller in the tailgate that senses when it is vertical vs. horizontal and that the signal or signal impedance is changed and the main processor for the screen is either looking for a different signal level.
Does anyone have a schematic of the tailgate camera wiring and connections?
Wide open to suggestions.
I've solved the issues with my truck and removing the tailgate - pic is in my previous post.
Now I am trying to figure out the cameras in the tailgate, it appears that the '23 & '24 King Ranch up to Limited have the standard rear view + the "tail gate down" rear view (2 cameras).
I've removed the cameras and tried both connected directly under the truck.
When I do this, it kills all cameras - I suspect that there is a controller in the tailgate that senses when it is vertical vs. horizontal and that the signal or signal impedance is changed and the main processor for the screen is either looking for a different signal level.
Does anyone have a schematic of the tailgate camera wiring and connections?
Wide open to suggestions.
Have you picked up your Hawk yet? If so, how did it go? I am in almost exact same situation: Hawk installation on February 28 on my 2024 F250 Lariat with 360 camera. There was no tailgate removal kit in my glovebox when I bought the truck new from a dealer in November of 2024. I am headed to dealer later this week to have them figure out tailgate removal situation. Fingers crossed. Would be interested to know if you have additional words of wisdom for me
Yes, I picked up a week ago. Took it out camping and everything worked perfectly.
My Windows don't fold automatically (I can do manually) and I have the tailgate open red icon on dash. Only two issues which I can probably live with. My local Ford dealer investigated the issue with their head tech and came up with a fix they are willing to do, but cost not covered by warranty. Said probably $400 bucks so I am kicking this around.
I had to call the dealer I purchased the truck from and had them send me the tailgate delete kit which they did free of charge. These are really only caps so they do not change the operation of anything.
Keep me posted on what you find out.
Post 110 shows your fix for the mirrors folding and warning light for the tailgate.
Easy to do.
Yes, I know about this, but with my hacking abilities not sure I could tackle this on my own. I might later if I get to that point.
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