First time camper purchase - Thoughts on Brinkley?

[Hatbox]

Yeah, they use Llippert frames much like everyone else. Brinkley making their own frames and coming standard with the Gen Y hitch and the Sumo springs is nice. I put Sumo springs on my Grand Design and they do seem to help some. (Especially as I am near max axle weight/GVWR.)

Brinkleys aren't alone either, they have frame cracking issues as well. The frequency just seems to be a little less...currently.

 

[ramv]

Which is kind of crazy to me. We beat the heck out of utility trailers and goosenecks at work at full GVWR and typically we replace the axles several times, and everything else many times long before we ever crack a frame. I don't think we have replace an actual gooseneck trailer. (Just every part of it) in 11 years and that's 11 years of oilfield roads every day. We actually upgraded from 20k axles to 24k lb axles on most of them.

 

[RS90]

Which is kind of crazy to me. We beat the heck out of utility trailers and goosenecks at work at full GVWR and typically we replace the axles several times, and everything else many times long before we ever crack a frame. I don't think we have replace an actual gooseneck trailer. (Just every part of it) in 11 years and that's 11 years of oilfield roads every day. We actually upgraded from 20k axles to 24k lb axles on most of them.

Go compare the thickness of gooseneck to a camper frame.

Business users are less price conscious compared to a private owner. A business plans to use a trailer to make money so the higher upfront cost for better materials is worth it to avoid issues.

Camper manufacturers could absolutely build a camper that could take any abuse you could throw at it. It would weigh 40,000 lbs and cost $500,000.

Nobody would buy that. Campers are 100% a luxury vehicle that a large majority of owners can't actually afford to begin with. They want a trailer they can pull with a common pickup truck so it has been be light weight. Thats how they end up with frames made of 16ga steel. Then they want it to be even lighter so they build the walls out of tooth picks and single ply toilet paper. The appliances are all built in China by 1 company that bought all the independent manufacturers and outsourced it to keep prices down.

The trailers are mostly built by workers on an assembly line working for not great wages with no incentive to actually care about quality.

People then go ripping down the interstate with their paper shack at 85 mph and can't understand why the wheels are blowing up and the walls are all cracking.

I had a 2018 Grand Design travel trailer. I traded it in for a 2022 Forest River 5th wheel toy hauler. Looking under the cabinets and inside the underbelly they are built exactly the same. The wiring is a shit show and the plumbing isn't much better.

I had more issues with my Grand Design than I do with the Forest River. The FR is 50% bigger and a Toy hauler for the exact same price as my GD.

I'd rather buy the cheaper Firest River and used the saved money to upgrade it myself. I've already started replacing the cardboard/MDF cabinets with custom built ones made from actual wood.

 

[71stang99]

Northwood which makes the Arctic Fox, Nash and others builds their own frames. We had a 2016 24J that was built like a tank. We switched to Lance 2022 2285 for the interior and then the Brinkley because the Lance felt cramped. We would have considered the AF again but were not keen on the dated interior.

 

[Blade420Play🔪🏆]

I'd rather buy the cheaper Firest River and used the saved money to upgrade it myself. I've already started replacing the cardboard/MDF cabinets with custom built ones made from actual wood.

What kind of wood are you going with? I will have to do this eventually, got some water damage from a bad slide seal and some of the paper is peeling off. I don't care too much seeing as I have two small kids at the moment but, when it starts disintegrating fully, I'd like to replace them without making it too much heavier

 

[RS90]

What kind of wood are you going with? I will have to do this eventually, got some water damage from a bad slide seal and some of the paper is peeling off. I don't care too much seeing as I have two small kids at the moment but, when it starts disintegrating fully, I'd like to replace them without making it too much heavier

I just used quality pine and A grade plywood from Menards. Had a local paint shop custom mix a stain to get close to the original color.

Before


After



Gained 3 drawers and usable storage space behind the fireplace. The old drawers only went about halfway into the cabinet.

The real surprise was finding screws holding the counter top to the wall. They were installed before the outside skin was pur on so no way to remove them because the heads were inside the wall.

It is quite a bit heavier but not enough to worry me.

 

[Blade420Play🔪🏆]

I just used quality pine and A grade plywood from Menards. Had a local paint shop custom mix a stain to get close to the original color.

Before
View attachment 269417

After
View attachment 269418View attachment 269419


Gained 3 drawers and usable storage space behind the fireplace. The old drawers only went about halfway into the cabinet.

The real surprise was finding screws holding the counter top to the wall. They were installed before the outside skin was pur on so no way to remove them because the heads were inside the wall.

It is quite a bit heavier but not enough to worry me.

Fully 3/4" or 19/32 everywhere or just front/sides?

 

[RS90]

Fully 3/4" or 19/32 everywhere or just front/sides?

1x2 and 1x3 pine for the frame. Drawer boxes are made of 1/2 plywood. Drawers fronts are 3/4 edge glued pine. Menards sells many sizes of pre made edge glued pine boards as shelves. I just cut them down to size using a table saw.

 

[ramv]

Go compare the thickness of gooseneck to a camper frame.

Business users are less price conscious compared to a private owner. A business plans to use a trailer to make money so the higher upfront cost for better materials is worth it to avoid issues.

Camper manufacturers could absolutely build a camper that could take any abuse you could throw at it. It would weigh 40,000 lbs and cost $500,000.

Nobody would buy that. Campers are 100% a luxury vehicle that a large majority of owners can't actually afford to begin with. They want a trailer they can pull with a common pickup truck so it has been be light weight. Thats how they end up with frames made of 16ga steel. Then they want it to be even lighter so they build the walls out of tooth picks and single ply toilet paper. The appliances are all built in China by 1 company that bought all the independent manufacturers and outsourced it to keep prices down.

The trailers are mostly built by workers on an assembly line working for not great wages with no incentive to actually care about quality.

People then go ripping down the interstate with their paper shack at 85 mph and can't understand why the wheels are blowing up and the walls are all cracking.

I had a 2018 Grand Design travel trailer. I traded it in for a 2022 Forest River 5th wheel toy hauler. Looking under the cabinets and inside the underbelly they are built exactly the same. The wiring is a shit show and the plumbing isn't much better.

I had more issues with my Grand Design than I do with the Forest River. The FR is 50% bigger and a Toy hauler for the exact same price as my GD.

I'd rather buy the cheaper Firest River and used the saved money to upgrade it myself. I've already started replacing the cardboard/MDF cabinets with custom built ones made from actual wood.

All great points. I went from a 2018 Lance 1985 (no wood, terrible wiring, same appliances as all and frame was likely not rated for a rear hitch even though they offered one. potentially that was the pre 2017 model though) Wiring on both 12volt, 120v and solar was garbage. It had Torflex axles and towed like a dream. Axles weren’t straight and wore out tires every 5k miles but that was five years for me so I didn’t care much since I didn’t want an old tire to dry rot. I should have taken it to Turnkey for an axle alignment since I lived right beside them for a year.

Speaking of which I did have Turnkey build a work “RV.” Slides, half bath, lots of leather seats and monitors, self contained genset and satellite internet, auto leveling. It weighed 40klb and cost $425k. In 2012. 40’ trailer. The 50’ had a game room and cost over $500k. We had a custom Kenworth (well really all Kenworths are custom) T-800 with an automatic transmission to pull it. Back then automatics were rare especially in a heavy frame/dual locker chassis but we figured it would be less stress on the trailer. Back then they cost around $125k. Now automatic is standard but closer to $200k for a base model.

Your point on thin/inhouse frames makes a lot of sense. I recalled a meeting a long time ago with the VP of Sales for Stewart and Stevenson (heavy equipment manufacturer) who proudly showed me pictures and designs of 2,250 hp diesel pumps they had built in-house including custom frames to weigh less than 80klb with the tractor. Sounded great. Fast forward several years later and I was now managing a fleet of over 200 of said pumps and found out the hard way the frames would flex so bad under pumping that the pump casing became the stressed member and would crack. You could weld them a few times but after awhile it was a new $200k pump casing.

I guess I get it, but also I do appreciate the redneck toyhaulers of a gooseneck with a bed camper on it and the open deck for the toy. Or if money grew on trees a custom living quarters horse hauler with a side by side garage instead of livestock bay. Those things are nice but always seem to be hooked to F550s…

 

[Phillbo]