2021 Tremor Switch to 2023 Tremor Observations

[ccw]

Skipping gears is the Worst feature of these transmissions, I've driven in tow/haul since I brought er home. If it's skipping gears from the factory, they've essentially admitted it has too many gears!!

I couldn't agree with you more.

With so much power these engines produce (6.7L), I am just not sure why you need soo many gears.

I thought 6 was perfect; 8 would have been probably still good. 10 is simply overkill.

To play devil’s advocate, do semi trucks have too many gears because semi drivers skip gears when lightly loaded?

(I’m not a semi driver, so someone correct me if my understanding of this is wrong.)

While the argument is less sound for the 7.3L as it’s maximum weight is lower, the fact is these transmissions have to work with wildly variable weights. On the top end over 40,000 pounds GCW, at the bottom end around 8000 pounds GCW.

Makes sense to me that you want the extra gears when maxed out, but don’t need them when at lower weights. Just like how semis work.

 

[Mike1646]

Semis do skip gears when pulling light loads.

 

[ccw]

Semis do skip gears when pulling light loads.

Thanks for the confirmation!

To play devil’s advocate, do semi trucks have too many gears because semi drivers skip gears when lightly loaded?

(I’m not a semi driver, so someone correct me if my understanding of this is wrong.)

While the argument is less sound for the 7.3L as it’s maximum weight is lower, the fact is these transmissions have to work with wildly variable weights. On the top end over 40,000 pounds GCW, at the bottom end around 8000 pounds GCW.

Makes sense to me that you want the extra gears when maxed out, but don’t need them when at lower weights. Just like how semis work.

And I want to clarify my argument: I'm not saying that Ford's implementation of skipping gears is perfect - it's pretty clear it needs some work. I believe the concept is sound, and well-proven for decades in the world of semi trucks.

 

[Donnie With A Dee]

To play devil’s advocate, do semi trucks have too many gears because semi drivers skip gears when lightly loaded?

As someone with over a million miles behind the wheel of a big rig, I feel that I am very qualified to answer. As stated above, there is no skipping once rolling however when lightly loaded or bobtailing you may start out in a higher gear. For example when bobtailing (no trailer attached) you might start off in third or fourth gear. Also if the trailer is empty you may potentially start in second or third. Just depends on the number of gears the transmission has, 7, 9, 10, 13, or 18, you may use a different starting gear. Hope that clears it up.

 

[super_fro_daddy]

Going 1 3 5 out the gate it falls on its face, or at least 1st to 3rd it does. 9th and 10th are 100 rpm apart (pointless there). Removed 9th and another one elsewhere, and what do you have?? A nice 8 spd that is already produced ZF ( i know nothing of they're quality and reliability). I get the diesels have too much torque for that one but some mfr could make one all the trucks could use.

We've really gone off the rails of this thread!!

 

[ccw]

As someone with over a million miles behind the wheel of a big rig, I feel that I am very qualified to answer. As stated above, there is no skipping once rolling however when lightly loaded or bobtailing you may start out in a higher gear. For example when bobtailing (no trailer attached) you might start off in third or fourth gear. Also if the trailer is empty you may potentially start in second or third. Just depends on the number of gears the transmission has, 7, 9, 10, 13, or 18, you may use a different starting gear. Hope that clears it up.

Ah I see. So Ford’s strategy doesn’t match what semi drivers do. Ford’s strategy always starts in 1st, then skips after that if deemed appropriate. Whereas semi drivers start in whatever is appropriate (not necessarily 1st), but hit every gear from that point on.

That makes sense and is a pretty significant difference from Ford’s implementation.

It would also require a lot more user input to have an automatic transmission work the way semi drivers do, so I wonder if that’s how Ford settled on the approach in 20-22MY. They still get full torque by starting in first and, once rolling, can determine whether or not to skip.

 

[richtor]

A few of us on some 7.3 Facebook pages that previously had 7.3's feel the same about a little additional power on the 23's. My 22' weighed about 7300lbs and my 23' weighs 6,600lbs so that's got to be some of it in addition to the extra 10tq. But the 22' had 4.30s, my 23' has 3.73's. Would be cool to see some dyno comparisons at some point.

What are the power differences between the 20-22 7.3 and the 23 7.3? How is the new truck that much lighter with the same power plant? The 23 7.3 does not come with 4.30's anymore? Is 4.30's an option with the 7.3?

 

[blumhagen]

Ah I see. So Ford’s strategy doesn’t match what semi drivers do. Ford’s strategy always starts in 1st, then skips after that if deemed appropriate. Whereas semi drivers start in whatever is appropriate (not necessarily 1st), but hit every gear from that point on.

That makes sense and is a pretty significant difference from Ford’s implementation.

It would also require a lot more user input to have an automatic transmission work the way semi drivers do, so I wonder if that’s how Ford settled on the approach in 20-22MY. They still get full torque by starting in first and, once rolling, can determine whether or not to skip.

Pretty sure an auto 18 would start in first. The only reason the driver doesn’t is when they know what they have for weight. The computer doesn’t know that.

 

[Rockshot]

What are the power differences between the 20-22 7.3 and the 23 7.3? How is the new truck that much lighter with the same power plant? The 23 7.3 does not come with 4.30's anymore? Is 4.30's an option with the 7.3?

1. 23' has a little 10tq bump over 20-22' 7.3 per ford
2. My 22' was a crew cab long bed lariat ultimate 7.3, my 23' is a ccsb XL. Im guessing longbed and extra tech on the 22' is the reason for wieght discrepancy
3. 23' 7.3 can be had with 3.73 or 4.30

I'm saying my 23' feels a little peppier, if that's a real word, but noting that it weighs a bit less too. 10tq+700lb less+skip shift eliminated=feels snappier.

 

[richtor]

1. 23' has a little 10tq bump over 20-22' 7.3 per ford
2. My 22' was a crew cab long bed lariat ultimate 7.3, my 23' is a ccsb XL. Im guessing longbed and extra tech on the 22' is the reason for wieght discrepancy
3. 23' 7.3 can be had with 3.73 or 4.30

I'm saying my 23' feels a little peppier, if that's a real word, but noting that it weighs a bit less too. 10tq+700lb less+skip shift eliminated=feels snappier.

I went ahead and built a 250 on Ford's website and every time I took 4.30's off the truck it also took the Tremor option off as well. If you get the 7.3 Tremor it will come with 4.30's.

 

[4wheels and a hitch]

I have just under 1,000 miles on my 23. I am not sure yet if it feels peppier than the 21. I do like the sound of the engine going through all 10 gears.
I do believe the Tremor package calls for the 4.30 rear axle.

 

[Guest6749]

My 23 feels a little faster than my 22 also. 22 had 3.55 gears while 23 has 3.73, but thats not a big enough gear difference to REALLY feel IMO... maybe on a Vette, but not an 8k lb truck...

I think part of why it feels a bit peppier is the trans tuning that doesnt skip 2nd and go straight to 3rd from 1st. Keeps the motor in the power band.

The 23 also is a bit louder...more bald eagle sounds can be heard. Dont know why this is. Trucks are almost identical builds. Wondering if the 23 has less sound insulation than the 22. 23 has carpet delete but I doubt that has any meaningful impact on hearing engine noise.


And I still have not figured out why anybody gives 2 shits how many gears a transmission has... its not like you are rowing gears yourself. All the 10spds I have experience with(GM 10spd in Camaro, 10spd in HD truck, 10spd in Exploder, 10spd in F150, 10spd in 2022 f250, 10spd in 2023 F350) have shifted really nicely so I dont really care what its doing, generally speaking. The Camaro 10spd was by far the best...I mean no contest... would like my F350 10spd to shift like that. The Ford shift programing is not great, but the 23 is leaps and bounds better than the 22. When towing its slow to downshift and you end up out of the power band and then its down 1 to many gears trying to catch up. If you manually shift it a bit early you can keep it in a better gear because you dont lose so much momentum and drop out of the power band before it has to shift... thats on the 7.3. I have not driven a diesel superduty with 10spd.

 

[Rockshot]

I went ahead and built a 250 on Ford's website and every time I took 4.30's off the truck it also took the Tremor option off as well. If you get the 7.3 Tremor it will come with 4.30's.

True. I've don't have a tremor. I do have a cool 4x4 sticker though

 

[Rockshot]

rjacobs, "bald eagle sound." I like that!

 

[ccw]

Pretty sure an auto 18 would start in first. The only reason the driver doesn’t is when they know what they have for weight. The computer doesn’t know that.

So your comment got me curious, and looks like Eaton has solved that problem! Seems like it’s a relatively recent advancement, but their Endurant XD Pro line, which goes up to 18 speeds, is able to start in gears other than first as well as skip shift.

First, here’s the feature’s table from Eaton’s website:

Endurant XD automated transmission

The Endurant XD transmission is designed to deliver comfort, drivability, and efficiency in on-highway applications. It has 18 forward and up to 6 reverse speeds.

www.eatoncummins.com

It’s covered in a few features, but Smart Gear Selection hits both skip shifting and starting gear.

Second, here’s a dump truck driver and YouTuber directly commenting on the feature (start at 8m 38s if it doesn’t automatically):

For context, the dump truck in the video consists of an 83,000 pound truck and 29,000 pound trailer for a gross combined weight of 112,000 pounds.

I have no idea how the transmission figures out which gear to start in. But that’s pretty dang cool.

 

[richtor]

True. I've don't have a tremor. I do have a cool 4x4 sticker though View attachment 126043

Great Looking Truck! Congrats

 

[Rockshot]

A few of us on some 7.3 Facebook pages that previously had 7.3's feel the same about a little additional power on the 23's. My 22' weighed about 7300lbs and my 23' weighs 6,600lbs so that's got to be some of it in addition to the extra 10tq. But the 22' had 4.30s, my 23' has 3.73's. Would be cool to see some dyno comparisons at some point.

Weighed my truck yesterday after taking some metal to the scrap yard. 6,740lb with 37's, 2 hitches and some misc. supplys in the truck. So probably about right on point with the 6,559lb ford has truck listed at. 23' F250 xl stx ccsb 7.3. Exactly 400lb lighter than my 17' 6.2 lariat ccsb. Even with 37's this thing walks all over the 6.2 towing.

 

[4wheels and a hitch]

We still think the 23 Lariat is more quiet inside than the 21 XLT. So far, the transmission is okay. I am waiting for the winter to see if the cold weather engagement is softer than the 21. I have to agree with others that the "leather" seats are not as comfortable as the cloth WLT seats. This motor runs smoother at idle than the 21. I still have not run it hard enough to say if it is peppier but it does pass a slower moving car as fast as the 21.

 

[VB!]

Lowes had a sale on mulch this weekend so I went down to buy 50 bags and some gravel. I made the purchase, loaded the gravel, and waited for them to bring out the mulch. Some good talk with others in the parking lot about the truck and I lost track of time. So did Lowes as they forgot to bring out the mulch. I went back in and reminded them. They brought it out and as an apology offered the whole pallet to save loading time. So 65 bags of mulch and 11 bags of gravel later I was on my way.

This was about 2,800 pounds in the bed and well under payload of 3,300 and change. If it was my 21 I would have been over payload. I guess we can call this a '23 leveling kit.