Where do we live and why?

West Bend, WI

Pros:
Only 30k people so it has a very small town feel to it.
Big enough to have ever store/restaurant one could need.
4 seasons. Very nice to have that
Close to Lake Michigan
Close enough tp the Upper Peninsula of Michigan.
Retiring here when the time comes.

Cons:
FIBS (if you have to ask, you aren't from here)
Can be lots of snow
Can have seriously cold days. Last winter, with wind chill, -60 degrees F
Southern WI small town just outside of Beloit. I love WI, just not southern WI. Work and family keeps me down here but I have a cabin in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan that I bought when my youngest was under 1. I absolutely love the U.P. and that's where we spend most our vacation time. Wish I lived closer to the cabin (6hr drive) If I could I would live in central WI which is really nice and be a short drive to northern WI and my cabin. I would miss the 4 seasons moving anywhere else as I enjoy them all. When I retire I would like to sell the house in southern WI, keep the cabin and purchase a house in FL to have a place to take a break from the long and snowy U.P. winters. One of the benefits of where I live in southern WI is I have about 7 acres in the country with no visible neighbors so its quiet. I also like being only a hr to hr and 1/2 away from some of the big urban areas like Milwuakee, Chicago and Madison which is nice for sporting events, concerts ect. If I could move my employment and family to the U.P. I would do it in a heartbeat. Housing is dirt cheap tons of stuff to do if you're a outdoorsman and the few people that live up there are the nicest you will meet.
 
Just outside of Montgomery, Alabama

I've traveled all over the country my whole life and I'm about to leave the worst area I've ever worked for in my 36 years of life. Rio Grande Valley, TX. from the water quality, the litter and the vitriol amongst the local work force you couldn't pay me to stay here any longer. The Governor has impressed me as of recently but RGV Texas is unbelievably depressing.

Sweet home Alabama or better known as "Alabama the Beautiful" is green and lush and has all the resources needed to build a sustainable life. Black soil, wildlife, waterways, cheap land, low taxes and hospitality. My permanent residence in Alabama actually became even more valuable to me over the years with the contrast I get from traveling so much. The only other areas I have found that holds a candle to it has been St. Marys, GA., Brevard., NC and Townsend, TN. I hear fantastic things about Utah, New Mexico and Wyoming which I hope to experience one day.

Cons:
Some of the more well known shortcomings of Alabama are concentrated in city centers obviously. School systems, crime and poverty are easy to find if you know where to look. Look at the local politicians and you can predict the economic and societal outcome to 100% accuracy. Our new Senator, Auburn Football coach Tommy Tuberville seems to be doing a Jam Up Job so far and I hope these guys start cleaning house a bit. I'd love to see Alabama get back on our A Game with certain issues.

Great thread. My truck isn't a Tremor but I'm glad I got involved with this group.
 
I reading here on this thread that people stay for a variety of factors, but not one of them is economic. Is that the case or am I misreading the posts from folks that live there?

The data would suggest that economics is a major component. As that famous Democrat said, "It's the economy, stupid." I don't make $500K/yr but I still pay a lot of taxes that are being wasted with epic stupidity and for which I perceive little value to me. Only about 5% of us pay CA income tax. The rest are moochers. Not only is there an exodus of 'my people' but plenty of businesses are leaving too. CA has long been rated the least business friendly state in the union by any objective viewer. Even Tesla is leaving for Texas!
 
CA has long been rated the least business friendly state in the union by any objective viewer. Even Tesla is leaving for Texas!

I pay employees in more than a dozen states. Most of the ones mentioned here.

Each state is punitive to businesses in different ways. The ways in which California is anti-business is in large part due to the ways in which it’s pro-employee. I have employees and pay corporate taxes in Texas too, and I used to live there. The ways in which its pro-business is in large part due to the ways it’s anti-employee.

And more broadly the Texas system as an extreme is no more sustainable than the California system as an extreme. They’re optimizing for different things, hoping the short term gains are not offset by the long-term losses. Texas is focused on growth. California is focused on unit economics.

At the end of it all, they’ve both got to balance a budget.

There’s no free lunch, as someone else here said.
 
I’ll add that many of the ways you hear about businesses being squeezed in California are not just about the state but local governments. Our major cities are playing the same game California is playing against other states, and the U.S. is playing against other countries. “We’re full, we don’t need you, and we can squeeze who we have.”

In the cities this means squeezing businesses for little in exchange. This collapsed during the pandemic. And has resulted in many of the headlines that you see. Major corporations squabbling with local leaders drunk on a false sense of power rooted in marketplace dynamics that are rapidly fleeting.
 
Minnesota.

Good.
It's actually a beautiful state, abundance of outdoor adventures, clean, love the st croix river and the north shore along lake superior. It's a state where you can make big money. I've been here 10 years now. Wife and I triple our salaries moving from the south to MN. Rural MN is conservative, nice good folks for the most part. MN has a very underrated cuisine industry. Excellent schools, though they need to teach true history and about the original Republic and US constitution, our rights as citizens

The bad..
Well, viscous, mean, corrupt Democrat lunacy stronghold in the twin cities. Need i say More? The Kazarian mafia controlled corrupt politicians are just ruining Minneapolis/Saint paul and this country all over. They fuel the riots with anti-police rhetoric, lots of DS bs going on. Gov Walz has to be one of the worst Gov MN has ever had.
Thankfully more people are waking up to this horrific world wide corruption.
 
Soop, I'm all for paying people a fair wage with benefits but CA leads the nation down the slippery slope to Euro-socialism where it's almost impossible to fire someone or even lay them off. That's great for the employees but it is especially hard, if not right punitive, on small businesses. In effect it unfairly subsidizes large business. Why do you think it takes so long to be visited by a waiter in a French or Italian restaurant? Sure, some of them hate us, but it's really that they are understaffed plus they know that they can't be fired for being lazy, slow, or even insulting.
 
Soop, I'm all for paying people a fair wage with benefits but CA leads the nation down the slippery slope to Euro-socialism where it's almost impossible to fire someone or even lay them off. That's great for the employees but it is especially hard, if not right punitive, on small businesses. In effect it unfairly subsidizes large business. Why do you think it takes so long to be visited by a waiter in a French or Italian restaurant? Sure, some of them hate us, but it's really that they are understaffed plus they know that they can't be fired for being lazy, slow, or even insulting.

And in many *truly* socialist countries, the opposite is all true.

As a business owner, I see both sides. I don’t actually think CA’s employee protections are unfair to me as a business owner. I can fire people for poor performance, no problem. Nowhere near close to impossible.
 
The American system is rooted in Adam Smith’s ideas of economic prosperity through rational self-interest and competition.

Ford : Dodge
Democrat : Republican
California : Texas
America : Most Developed Countries

These are all brands in competition. We are consumers. If you allow marketing and propaganda, or whatever personal belief one of these brands is appealing to at the moment, limit your ability to act rationally in your best self-interest and freedom to benefit from competition don’t be surprised when your product of choice gets more expensive and lower quality in short order.
 
The American system is rooted in Adam Smith’s ideas of economic prosperity through rational self-interest and competition.

Ford : Dodge
Democrat : Republican
California : Texas
America : Most Developed Countries

These are all brands in competition. We are consumers. If you allow marketing and propaganda, or whatever personal belief one of these brands is appealing to at the moment, limit your ability to act rationally in your best self-interest and freedom to benefit from competition don’t be surprised when your product of choice gets more expensive and lower quality in short order.
It's hard to imagine that brand is the driving force behind the exodus from California. If it truly was/is, then I can see how you are becoming the California "Brand Ambassador" for California. In discussions I have had with Californians, I have not heard one speak as passionately about California and its virtues as you have. You certainly have a unique perspective.
 
At the end of the day it’s important to consider that California is by far the largest state entity in the US.

It accounts for ~15% of US GDP (and about the same percentage of the total US population.)

Its economy is one of the largest in the world, and its extremely diversified relative to many other US states.

In many ways California vs. any other fine state is like the United States vs. any other fine country. It demands a premium because it can. And that premium is expected to turn some customers away. Justified or not. Long term sustainable or not.

If you don’t like high taxes in California you can move to the Mexican/Canadian border. If you don’t like high taxes in the U.S. you can move to Mexico/Canada.

States are products in a capitalist society. Buy whatever brand speaks to you.
On this topic, another question would be the power shortage I have heard my work colleagues from California refer to. I understand that there are some legal issues around forcing the State of Arizona to sell its surplus of power to California at below market rates as the consumption of power in California has significantly outpaced its ability to supply power to it's own residents. Wondering what the economic impact of environmental policies in California are having on other states that do not have as strict a policy. I was interested to learn how involved California is in the production of Oil and Gas with pump heads and refineries in the state that are still very much in operation.
Interesting to learn more about this.
 
It's hard to imagine that brand is the driving force behind the exodus from California. If it truly was/is, then I can see how you are becoming the California "Brand Ambassador" for California. In discussions I have had with Californians, I have not heard one speak as passionately about California and its virtues as you have. You certainly have a unique perspective.
Part of the brand is a premium price. So is environmental regulation, and somewhat progressive social policy. They’re features of the product meant to appeal to a target consumer.

I’m just playing devils advocate here.
 
CA - where nothing is not considered unworthy of a law or ridiculous regulation. Name me one public place you can go where you will not see a sign saying

"The State of California has determined that you may be exposed to chemicals that MAY be harmful."

Making and selling those signs is a great business to be in but it sure costs a LOT of money, and for what? Do you think there are three people in this state of 39 million who are going to turn around and leave Ikea because of that sign?
 
Kirkland WA. Been here since I was a tot...54 years in total.

See Fatawan's post for the good and bad.

Our State's politics have gotten out of control (unless you are a ultra liberal).

Trying to think of where to head off to. Some friends have moved to DFW and like it. The worry is all of the political refugees from the left coast will infect the local political scene but if that happens I guess it's the local's fault.

BTW, Washington just mandated that no more petro powered vehicles (light duty) can be sold in the state after 2030.
 
CA - where nothing is not considered unworthy of a law or ridiculous regulation. Name me one public place you can go where you will not see a sign saying

"The State of California has determined that you may be exposed to chemicals that MAY be harmful."

Making and selling those signs is a great business to be in but it sure costs a LOT of money, and for what? Do you think there are three people in this state of 39 million who are going to turn around and leave Ikea because of that sign?

Prop 65 is a law with great intentions but very poor execution. I've met many business owners who just stick the warning on their products even though they may not contain any of the chemicals listed by CA. To them, it's easier to add the square inch warning than to prove to CA that there are no carcinogens in the products. The warning is not going to make a difference to revenue anyway, since 99% of customers gloss over the warnings.
 

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