GCWR only

In PA, I would be required to get a CDL or a class A non-CDL license, depending on whether I was towing commercial or recreational. They go by the combined sticker ratings here. Cannot exceed 26,000# GCVWR if towing anything over 10K with having the right license (and I have no interest in getting either). With a 24,900# GCVWR, I'm safe with a 10K GVWR truck and 14K GVWR trailer. I'll be towing around 12.5K commercially at times and my truck should be in the 9K area when loaded down with the trailer.
I didn't think about that as I have had a CDL since 95'. I guess after pulling triples that weight 105,000# down the road I looked at 30,000 as though it was nothing. I don't use my license for my living anymore but it's fairly easy to keep up so I keep it because you never know what's going to happen. However much weight my Tremor will pull, it will be 100% legal.
 
Download this file and change the .zip to .xlsx...it's the best towing calculator I have seen and it is an excel speadsheet...(if it works)

OK I tested this and it works.......Download it, rename the.zip to .xlsx...and enjoy!!
I have this sheet also. Its good for your calculations to determine the limits of your truck. Attached is another sheet for when you weigh your truck and tow at the CAT scales to see how much you are carrying on all the axles, pin weight and capacities of both truck and tow. Same procedures for downloading...rename zip to .xlsx.
 

Attachments

  • TOWABLE RV WEIGHT CALCULATIONS.zip
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Towing is a very complicated subject because so many numbers and acronyms are tossed about. Then it is further complicated by manufacture's claims. If you use the spread sheet above you are likely to be legal. I say likely because you do not want to exceed your tire ratings, wheel, or axel. So after you get this spreadsheet all green and good to go , Load up and go verify your rig.

You do not want to be hit by a drunk driver who kills some people and YOU are found to be at fault because one number was 50Lbs over!!
Other people are definitely in my top 3 for concerns when towing. I mainly haul my wife's horses and people just don't know to be safe for the horses I need even more time to stop and go than even people pulling a large cargo trailer except for maybe real truck drivers. But I will definitely check out your excel sheet I'm sure it wont take much to max out the axles compared to the rest of the truck.
 
That is the 2nd biggest concern for me ... the 1st is that if I am forced to get a CDL, then I can't even enjoy 1 beer at a party without being considered legally drunk (no matter what I am driving), so I am staying under 26K period.
the 26000 lbs is where I get really confused. Is that actual weight or GCWR?

Like the GVWR of an F350 tremor is 11500lbs. So I can't town a 5er with a GVWR of 16800lbs unless I have a CDL because 11500+16800 = 28300?

Dually's go up to like 14500 GVWR.....so all those guys I see on the road in their dually pulling a giant 5er have a CDL?


Seems in CA you can get a non-commercial Class A, but I'm not sure you can get over 26Klbs combined even with that as the DMV website is not very clear at all.
 
That is the 2nd biggest concern for me ... the 1st is that if I am forced to get a CDL, then I can't even enjoy 1 beer at a party without being considered legally drunk (no matter what I am driving), so I am staying under 26K period.
I don't know if this is just California or if it is a Federal DOT rule. My good friend who is a retired CHP sargent has told me the the .04 vs .08 blood alcohol level is dependent on which license you are using at the time. For example, driving your car you're using your class c therefore .08 is legally drunk. If you're using your class A for commercial purposes then you are considered legally drunk at .04.
 
the 26000 lbs is where I get really confused. Is that actual weight or GCWR?

Like the GVWR of an F350 tremor is 11500lbs. So I can't town a 5er with a GVWR of 16800lbs unless I have a CDL because 11500+16800 = 28300?

Dually's go up to like 14500 GVWR.....so all those guys I see on the road in their dually pulling a giant 5er have a CDL?


Seems in CA you can get a non-commercial Class A, but I'm not sure you can get over 26Klbs combined even with that as the DMV website is not very clear at all.
In California ANY trailer with a GVWR over 9,999 requires some sort of commercial license. I'm not clear on which one, sorry. That's why derating the trailer's GVWR is so popular, however that opens up a whole another can of worms. I do believe, but I am not completely sure that there is an exception for 5th wheel RV's up to 15,000. It is my belief that a fifth wheel RV over 15,000 pounds requires a non-commercial class A.
 
My understanding is it the actual weight of the combination not what the the vehicles are in rated for. Just because GVRW of the the truck is 10,000 doesn't mean your limited to a trailer with a GVWR of 14,900. Your trailer could have a higher rating as long as your actual GCWR doesn't physically exceed the 24,900. I have a 350 which has a GVWR of 11,300. I currently have a gooseneck flatbed on order that has a GVWR of 20,000. So between the unladen weight of the truck and the unladen weight of the trailer I should have a cargo carrying capacity of roughly 13,200 in order to stay under the 27,500 GCWR even though the sticker rating between the two is actually much higher. I should be legal as long as I stay under the 27,500.
Physically that is the case but depending on how your state rules are written they may follow the sum of Truck and Trailer GVWRs not actual weight for legally being over GCWR. Researching this can send you down a rabbit hole of rules and regulations but is good to familiarize your self on them for your state since the rules differ from state to state.

For the Op this will likely not be a issue. Since with a gooseneck horse trailer it is going to be very difficult staying under the trucks 10K GVWR with a loaded horse trailer over 14.9K GVWR.
 
I don't know if this is just California or if it is a Federal DOT rule. My good friend who is a retired CHP sargent has told me the the .04 vs .08 blood alcohol level is dependent on which license you are using at the time. For example, driving your car you're using your class c therefore .08 is legally drunk. If you're using your class A for commercial purposes then you are considered legally drunk at .04.
I don't know if it is Federal or not, in PA the alcohol tolerance level is reduced by 1/2 if you have a commercial license, no matter if you are walking, driving a vw beetle or driving a big rig. Owning the license changes everything.
 
In California ANY trailer with a GVWR over 9,999 requires some sort of commercial license. I'm not clear on which one, sorry. That's why derating the trailer's GVWR is so popular, however that opens up a whole another can of worms. I do believe, but I am not completely sure that there is an exception for 5th wheel RV's up to 15,000. It is my belief that a fifth wheel RV over 15,000 pounds requires a non-commercial class A.
I know that, but where it gets complicated is the combined weight. You need no special license to tow a 15,000 5er, but my truck gvwr is 11,500. 11,500 + 15000 = 26500, so then maybe a class A is needed even though the 5er isn't over 15K......or at 26500 CGVWR does a Class A not even do it? I've seen forums say anytime the combined GVWR exceeds 26000lbs you need a full blown CDL....BUT if my truck's GVWR was only 10K lbs I could tow that 15000 5er on a regular license....except for the fact that the pin weight on a 15000lb 5er would probably exceed payload capacity on such a truck.

DMV websites do nothing to demystify this crap and RV salesmen will probably just tell you anything to get you to sign. Then in CA there are registration weight fees and crap too.

When it comes time to buy a trailer, if it's a TT over 10K lbs or 5er over 15K I'm just going to call a dmv lawyer and just have him sort it out for me.

Maybe I'm overthinking things.
 
Remember, ignorance of the law is not a valid defense,
even if nobody can tell you what the law really requires of you. :rolleyes:
 
Physically that is the case but depending on how your state rules are written they may follow the sum of Truck and Trailer GVWRs not actual weight for legally being over GCWR. Researching this can send you down a rabbit hole of rules and regulations but is good to familiarize your self on them for your state since the rules differ from state to state.

For the Op this will likely not be a issue. Since with a gooseneck horse trailer it is going to be very difficult staying under the trucks 10K GVWR with a loaded horse trailer over 14.9K GVWR.
Impossible!!
 
I know that, but where it gets complicated is the combined weight. You need no special license to tow a 15,000 5er, but my truck gvwr is 11,500. 11,500 + 15000 = 26500, so then maybe a class A is needed even though the 5er isn't over 15K......or at 26500 CGVWR does a Class A not even do it? I've seen forums say anytime the combined GVWR exceeds 26000lbs you need a full blown CDL....BUT if my truck's GVWR was only 10K lbs I could tow that 15000 5er on a regular license....except for the fact that the pin weight on a 15000lb 5er would probably exceed payload capacity on such a truck.

DMV websites do nothing to demystify this crap and RV salesmen will probably just tell you anything to get you to sign. Then in CA there are registration weight fees and crap too.

When it comes time to buy a trailer, if it's a TT over 10K lbs or 5er over 15K I'm just going to call a dmv lawyer and just have him sort it out for me.

Maybe I'm overthinking things.
Up here in Sacramento there is a CDL specific DMV in West Sacramento.
They only deal with CDL road tests and anything to do with CDL licensing. I would do some checking and see if there is a DMV office near you that specializes in the same thing then go in there and talk to them. Another resource that I use is I call the weigh scales directly and ask my questions directly to the commercial officer.
 
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