Death Wobble

Iron Man

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I ordered a 2021 F-250 Platinum Tremor in Monday 8/24. Now all I do u search for Tremor Utube videos. I noticed that they have a lot of videos of the Super Duty with this CRAZY ASS WOBBLE IN THE STEERING WHEEL. They say it can happen at 70mph. Now I ride everything that I own LIKE I STOLE IT. So I plan on riding well above 70mph ALL THE TIME ON THE HYWY.
CJC Off Road customs in California has a great video on the Carli 2.5 Pintop suspensions. They have one box that says this is how Ford should have done the Tremor. It supposed to make the Tremor even better with the sickest ride. And tortion sway bar is supposed to stop the Death Wobble.

So does anyone ever experience the Desth Wobble and tell us about the experiences. And what if anything you did to fix the problem. Thanks Gentlemen
 

richtor

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1. The steering wheel shaking or wobble should not happen. If it does leave it at the dealer until they fix it.
2. How many SuperDuty's do they make each year, 800,000 units or so. No one can build that many units and have them all be the exact same.
3. I have seen or heard nothing about the wobble. I know many with SuperDuties and they all love them.
4. The one complaint on this forum the owner seems to care more about complaining than fixing the problem.
5. I am sure Carli is a great set up but they in no way will put more money into research design and engineering of the suspension than Ford will. That being said, one can create a softer suspension with more travel fairly easily.
6. Have you driven the Tremor yet? What are you experiences above 70mph?
 
OP
I

Iron Man

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1. The steering wheel shaking or wobble should not happen. If it does leave it at the dealer until they fix it.
2. How many SuperDuty's do they make each year, 800,000 units or so. No one can build that many units and have them all be the exact same.
3. I have seen or heard nothing about the wobble. I know many with SuperDuties and they all love them.
4. The one complaint on this forum the owner seems to care more about complaining than fixing the problem.
5. I am sure Carli is a great set up but they in no way will put more money into research design and engineering of the suspension than Ford will. That being said, one can create a softer suspension with more travel fairly easily.
6. Have you driven the Tremor yet? What are you experiences above 70mph?
Cool. I didn’t see a video on Tremors but it was showing ABC news with a class action lawsuit. And they had people filming this out of control shake to the steering wheel. It was fucking insane the videos they showed. So I’m glad to hear that. Thanks my brother
 
OP
I

Iron Man

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Cool. I didn’t see a video on Tremors but it was showing ABC news with a class action lawsuit. And they had people filming this out of control shake to the steering wheel. It was fucking insane the videos they showed. So I’m glad to hear that. Thanks my brother
I did test drive a Tremor with out the salesman. He let my wife and I go out and on our own. I drove over curbs and tore down some Roads I got it up to 70mph but for a short time. It was in South Hampton Long Island NY. The super Rich people area. It’s an Area where NYC richest go for the summer and all I could do was ride it like I stole it with roads with traffic lights every quarter of a mile. But I FUCKING LOVED RIDING IT. I WAS SOLD INSTANTLY ON IT. SO I BUILT A 2021 and will find out for myself around Thanksgiving I hope. But thanks for the feedback my man. 😎
 

Mountain Man

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I have 7000mi on my Tremor. I've spent a lot of time 75 - 85mph. Once you inflate the tires properly for an empty truck at 65psi front and 60psi rear, it drives like a dream. I've never experienced death wobble.
 

modified

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I'm planning a 1200 mile trip shortly with my Tremor and plan on doing well above 70mph. I'll report back!
 

JC_Tremor

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Have heard of this phenomenon...I have yet to experience it for myself. Been up to near 100, 7.3 here, smooth as butter.
 

davidb1841

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My coworker has a 19 f250 he had death wobble at 19k miles. Dealer replaced factory steering stabilizer. If you have your truck aligned and raise the castor to +4 degrees you virtually eliminate the problem. One other way is to install after market steering stabilizers. If you lift your truck and do not drop the rear radius arm bracket you will decrease your castor and increase the possibility of death wobble. It is a real issue not just with Ford...but all solid axle trucks.
 

richtor

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My coworker has a 19 f250 he had death wobble at 19k miles. Dealer replaced factory steering stabilizer. If you have your truck aligned and raise the castor to +4 degrees you virtually eliminate the problem. One other way is to install after market steering stabilizers. If you lift your truck and do not drop the rear radius arm bracket you will decrease your castor and increase the possibility of death wobble. It is a real issue not just with Ford...but all solid axle trucks.
It’s funny that nobody says anything about their lift when speaking of the wobble. I wonder why? Haha
 

davidb1841

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It’s funny that nobody says anything about their lift when speaking of the wobble. I wonder why? Haha
I was shopping Carli suspension and noticed they sell both castor shims and brackets to lower the radius arm mounting point....hmmmmm (might be a clue)
 

Rock Taxi

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I have built lots of solid axle suspensions and steering systems from the ground up. Death wobble is something that can happen to any vehicle, even IFS.

Usually, death wobble is caused by play in the mechanism that locates the axle or suspension under the vehicle - left to right. In our trucks, it is the track bar or panhard bar (from the drivers side frame to the passenger side of the axle) - the left to right bar that is in relative alignment with the drag link of the steering (from the steering gear box to the knuckle or tie rod, depending on setup).

When there is slop between the panhard or track bar and it's pivots, an oscillation can start - due to tire balancing, alignment, or anything that can cause a frequency based oscillation or vibration - that is not controlled by the panhard bar. The steering stays in one place, and the axle moves left and right, essentially making it like a rapid spin left and right of the steering - even though the wheel is held straight (until it is so bad you can't hold on to the steering wheel). This is the general cause of death wobble. It can be any of the parts mentioned, or even alignment issues like camber and caster, other mounting point issues like link bushings, steering box play, tie rod end slop, basically, anything that introduces "slop" in the system whether steering or axle location. That is why it is so hard to diagnose and cure.

One of my worst offenders, a Factory 2001 2WD F250 - the problem was the tie rod end at the steering box introduced the slop ( the rod end was barely worn and a year old, but had maybe a 1/16th inch of play, and my alignment - per the shop that fixed it - was drunk monkey did it) bad. A cheap part and good alignment solved the issue. The tie rod was the slop and the alignment introduced the oscillation.

I have had it in solid axle Jeeps, F250's, a 1970's Power Wagon and a couple of desert racers.

Bottom line, if the axle can shift from side to side due to mounting slop, and the steering remains fixed, the only place to "give" is the steering wheel. Death wobble is the result.

It's not rocket science, but it is hard to get everything tight enough without slop to prevent it from happening once you have got the issue..

Ed
 
Last edited:

jhblaze1

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1. The steering wheel shaking or wobble should not happen. If it does leave it at the dealer until they fix it.
2. How many SuperDuty's do they make each year, 800,000 units or so. No one can build that many units and have them all be the exact same.
3. I have seen or heard nothing about the wobble. I know many with SuperDuties and they all love them.
4. The one complaint on this forum the owner seems to care more about complaining than fixing the problem.
5. I am sure Carli is a great set up but they in no way will put more money into research design and engineering of the suspension than Ford will. That being said, one can create a softer suspension with more travel fairly easily.
6. Have you driven the Tremor yet? What are you experiences above 70mph?
Not to mention the youtubes of the lift shop saying "this is how ford shouldnhave built the truck". Well of course they're going to say that, theyre trying To sell lift kits.

Not for nothing but putting after market suspension on the tremor makes 0 sense. Youre paying $4K for a lift and tires package just to yank it put and put some random lift kit on it. Why wouldnt you just buy a regular f250 and then go have it lifted?

Lastly buying a nearly 4 ton truck and planning to recklessly speed in it is a recipe for disaster.
 

Chris21667

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I have built lots of solid axle suspensions and steering systems from the ground up. Death wobble is something that can happen to any vehicle, even IFS.

Usually, death wobble is caused by play in the mechanism that locates the axle or suspension under the vehicle - left to right. In our trucks, it is the track bar or panhard bar (from the drivers side frame to the passenger side of the axle) - the left to right bar that is in relative alignment with the drag link of the steering (from the steering gear box to the knuckle or tie rod, depending on setup).

When there is slop between the panhard or track bar and it's pivots, an oscillation can start - due to tire balancing, alignment, or anything that can cause a frequency based oscillation or vibration - that is not controlled by the panhard bar. The steering stays in one place, and the axle moves left and right, essentially making it like a rapid spin left and right of the steering - even though the wheel is held straight (until it is so bad you can't hold on to the steering wheel). This is the general cause of death wobble. It can be any of the parts mentioned, or even alignment issues like camber and caster, other mounting point issues like link bushings, steering box play, tie rod end slop, basically, anything that introduces "slop" in the system whether steering or axle location. That is why it is so hard to diagnose and cure.

One of my worst offenders, a Factory 2001 2WD F250 - the problem was the tie rod end at the steering box introduced the slop ( the rod end was barely worn and a year old, but had maybe a 1/16th inch of play, and my alignment - per the shop that fixed it - was drunk monkey did it) bad. A cheap part and good alignment solved the issue. The tie rod was the slop and the alignment introduced the oscillation.

I have had it in solid axle Jeeps, F250's, a 1970's Power Wagon and a couple of desert racers.

Bottom line, if the axle can shift from side to side due to mounting slop, and the steering remains fixed, the only place to "give" is the steering wheel. Death wobble is the result.

It's not rocket science, but it is hard to get everything tight enough without slop to prevent it from happening once you have got the issue..

Ed
GREAT POST!!!!!!
Death Wobble is a Solid axle experience Mainly only have had the issue in Solid front axle Vehicles but if you haven't experienced death wobble have you really experienced your truck or Jeep in my case but the 4 times i have had Death Wobble it has ALWAYS been the TRACK BAR.... i have had the worst play in my steering wheel in my Jeep where i could turn the steering wheel a half turn before it would start turning the steering box was shot and the Tie rod end didn't exist but i should did 75 mph on the highway in Kansas with no Death Wobble
 

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Grabber

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2 Super Duties ('05 & '15) prior to my Tremor and never have experienced death wobble. Now bump steer, absolutely ('15 was the worst). The Tremor is rock sold over bumps and I am still amazed of how well it is planted to the ground. It has only bump steered once in 2500 miles and that was in a slight turn and striking a large pot hole. Other than that it's been rock solid at all speeds and bumps.
 

ANVIL_01

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Not to mention the youtubes of the lift shop saying "this is how ford shouldnhave built the truck". Well of course they're going to say that, theyre trying To sell lift kits.

Not for nothing but putting after market suspension on the tremor makes 0 sense. Youre paying $4K for a lift and tires package just to yank it put and put some random lift kit on it. Why wouldnt you just buy a regular f250 and then go have it lifted?

Lastly buying a nearly 4 ton truck and planning to recklessly speed in it is a recipe for disaster.
“””””””Not for nothing but putting after market suspension on the tremor makes 0 sense.”””””””

Yup
 

davidb1841

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So here is another example of death wobble.....you ever get a shopping cart and the front wheels start flopping back and forth rapidly?....THATS death wobble. On your shopping cart your wheels have been bent forward or back changing the caster. When Death Wobble occurs, the Slop in your suspension (that Rock talks about) that allowed this to happen the first time (typically when you hit a bump), gets way worse as your 8000 lbs truck has its suspension VIOLENTLY shaken and vibrated till you hopefully slow it down. You end up with even more slop and suspension damage. Then it starts to occur even more frequently. Bottom line is to keep your alignment squared away....and to inspect your front suspension for play often. It does not take much wear to start this problem from occurring. And lifting your truck or towing can tip the scales over the edge of death wobble factors. You do not want to be crossing the Mackinac bridge towing a fifth wheel when hitting an expansion joint causes you to lose control of 21K lbs of steel
 
OP
I

Iron Man

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My coworker has a 19 f250 he had death wobble at 19k miles. Dealer replaced factory steering stabilizer. If you have your truck aligned and raise the castor to +4 degrees you virtually eliminate the problem. One other way is to install after market steering stabilizers. If you lift your truck and do not drop the rear radius arm bracket you will decrease your castor and increase the possibility of death wobble. It is a real issue not just with Ford...but all solid axle trucks.
Dude you know your shit. Good to know.
 
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